Irish Flyin Website

This is a forum for discussing General Aviation in Ireland

Moderator: mark

Pilot
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 602
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:39 pm

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by Pilot » Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:48 pm

I would love to attend, but unfortunately I am out of the country from early tomorrow. :(

jonkil
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:59 am
Location: Donegal. VFR Flight Guide IRL Page 131
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by jonkil » Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:11 pm

All the Fly-in's and events scheduled to happen at Letterkenny flying club for 2010 are cancelled. There will be no charity event for the Donegal Hospice over St.Patrick's day as planned, neither will there be our annual fly-in that was scheduled for June. I do not know if other clubs/airfields will follow suit.
The IAA have stated that they intend to prosecute visiting pilots on the UK NPPL licence, we cannot be seen to be encouraging UK visitors that will have the book thrown at them, therefore this regrettable decision has been made.
This is the reason that the NMAI have asked me to remove IrishFlyin.com
The IrishFlyin.com domain will be allowed to expire and the site will go off line permanently in due course.

Jon

nosedive
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 119
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 5:02 pm
Location: Mid-Louth

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by nosedive » Tue Feb 23, 2010 4:53 pm

...so why did the whole site have to be pulled??

And why are people flying in the republic with an NPPL - the IAA are only enforcing clear regulation, nothing's changed??

I get the impression people have been talking short cuts on their training and now it's coming back to bite.....
Another broken undercarriage........

willo
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 478
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:33 pm
Location: EIAB
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by willo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:04 pm

Prior to the actions indicate dat the start of this thread, If I'm a UK based NPPL(M) holder seeking to visit a fly-in in the Republic, what has been the requirement re validation of aircraft & licence to date?

jonkil
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:59 am
Location: Donegal. VFR Flight Guide IRL Page 131
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by jonkil » Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:52 pm

Hi Brian,
NPPL(M) holders are required to
1. Hold a Class 2 JAR Medical
2. Hold an RT Licence
3. Have 50 Hrs Pilot in Command
4. Have permission from IAA to operate G reg aircraft
5. Pay €80 for "validation" on licence
6. Send all off to the IAA for permission beforehand

I am a resident in Eire, I have absolutely no problem with doing this, I have done, the IAA have been more than helpful when I am doing so, it is not an issue for me at all.
The issue is that we cannot get a 28 day exemption for our "foreign" friends visiting like the rest of Europe does regarding the British NPPL. It is completely un-realistic to ask occasional visitors to our country to do this, also remember when I say "Foreign Friends" I am also referring to our Northern Ireland neighbours, they are in the UK too !
As for the quality of the NPPL, and the "short-cut" to training.... look at the statistics, statistics that the IAA have accepted. 4000 UK NPPL's issued, with a world beating safety record. Secret being that training is mostly done in small fields for the NPPL, like where I did mine in Kernan Valley a few years ago, when you learn to fly in places like that you can fly anywhere. The safety record isnt an issue, I have 1000 hours on a NPPL without issue, many other pilots have many times that on the UK NPPL, I fly throughout Ireland/all over the UK and Europe without a problem.
I have to keep a G reg aircraft as I do a lot of flying in the UK, I live right on the FIR between the Shannon and UK FIR therefore operating on the G reg is much easier. I don't have a problem with the Irish register, I would have my aircraft on the EI reg in the morning if I didn't live here, I am an inspector and check pilot for the NMAI for goodness sake, it would only make sense for me to do so, alas I cant.
Microlight training should be much more relaxed, after all the new RPL European licence is very closely modelled on the UK NPPL. it will be with us in the future, in the interim we are stuck with an almost full JAR compliant microlight licence here in Ireland, its ruining the RTF's here as most people fly on the UK licence, and in my opinion, rightly so. Lets hope that the future brings us a more relaxed structure and much more harmony with our European neighbours.
As for IrishFlyin.com, it will be laid to rest, we cannot be party to visitors to this country being prosecuted and saying that a website promoted fly-in's that resulted in prosecutions. This is sad, I had almost 40 UK mainland crews coming over to Letterkenny this year for the fly-in there, that will be 60 or 80 empty B&B or hotel bedrooms, Martin Anderson called me today asking why everyone was cancelling the accommodation for June, couldn't believe it when I told him.
All that will happen here is that it will promote illegal visits where crews will land in, stay to hell away from organised events and leave again as if they were never here, a nice welcome to Ireland don't you think?

Jon

willo
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 478
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:33 pm
Location: EIAB
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by willo » Tue Feb 23, 2010 7:35 pm

Hi Jon

You forgot the new attestation to knowing Air Law!!

Have Pm'ed you on this.

Talk later

Brian

holyflyer
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 83
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2004 5:09 pm
Location: London

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by holyflyer » Tue Feb 23, 2010 8:12 pm

Jonkil et al - deeply, deeply saddened by this turn of events. I fully understand your position and how you are caught. I just wonder how the IAA are going to police this enforcement. Clearly something has happened that may well have forced the IAA's hand at a political level.

Great shame - I was actually meeting a colleague at EGLM tomorrow for lunch to discuss the possibility of 'doing' the Letterkenny BBQ this year and stay with friends in Cresslough. (PPL/IMC). We might visit anyway.

For informatons sake you should cross-post the news onto the UK forums that you belong too.

User avatar
Nanolight
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 602
Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2005 12:57 pm
Location: At a computer Enemy: Gravity
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by Nanolight » Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:04 pm

The Flying in Ireland Events List is a fairly comprehensive guide to flyins in the interm.
Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back for breakfast.

User avatar
DonalMW
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 525
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:10 pm
Location: Essex Junction, VT, 05452 USA
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by DonalMW » Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:50 pm

I think you shouldn't pull the site. You should put a banner on top with a detailed disclaimer, absorbing you of any responsibility or possible litigation.
Back when I used to tour the country at the weekends it was a valuable (and well known) website for the Microlight and GA community.
It seems harsh to punish flyers that are "IAA compliant"
Just my 2 cents,

Letterkenny looks well from the club page. The hangars look well, I haven't been up there in about 18 months or so. Lovely spot, recommend to anyone.

jonkil
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:59 am
Location: Donegal. VFR Flight Guide IRL Page 131
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by jonkil » Wed Feb 24, 2010 3:18 pm

DonalMW wrote:I think you shouldn't pull the site. You should put a banner on top with a detailed disclaimer, absorbing you of any responsibility or possible litigation.
Back when I used to tour the country at the weekends it was a valuable (and well known) website for the Microlight and GA community.
It seems harsh to punish flyers that are "IAA compliant"
Just my 2 cents,

Letterkenny looks well from the club page. The hangars look well, I haven't been up there in about 18 months or so. Lovely spot, recommend to anyone.
Hi Donal,
thought about that too, but I do not want to be partly responsible for pilots and crews being targeted, and it is harsh for all that are IAA compliant, I myself am compliant with paperwork e.t.c.
As far as the Letterkenny club is concerned it is the death of any organised event, sad really as it was the biggest event in the country and probably the biggest club in the south, we always attracted a lot of the UK/Scottish folk, over 50 at the fly-in last year, see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-PX7CVEKqM The club will continue as an airfield without any formal gatherings in the future.
I wanted to try and bring back the Island-Hop event for 2010, it was a big promotion for the microlight fraternity, I even had sponsors talked to about it, I wont be going ahead with it at this stage either.
I am looking about promoting a few events in the UK where N.Ireland and NPPL holders can travel as an organised group, we have Popam in Hampshire in May, Ince Blundell in Lancashire in June, as well as the annual LAA rally in Sywell in Northamptonshire and a few others in Scotland like Strahaven to the south of Glasgow and the Scottish Islands too. Should still be good fun, but the Irish ones were always the best.
Maybe in the future things may change, but for now this is how it is.

Jon

User avatar
DonalMW
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 525
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:10 pm
Location: Essex Junction, VT, 05452 USA
Contact:

Re: Irish Flyin Website

Post by DonalMW » Wed Feb 24, 2010 3:54 pm

I understand your position Jon.

I flew to Popham 3 years ago, it's a great trip. I made it direct from Galway in 3 hrs.....

I was compliant on the NPPL (Validated).

This move might signal the start of a lot of "Illegal Border hopping".......

It is a bit much to ask our visiting neighbors to do a lot of paperwork just to make a trip.

It's kinda ironic that to the best of my knowledge the NPPL is excepted worldwide, except for the ROI which is its nearest neighbor.

Did that meeting go ahead last weekend down the country ? ? Any updates anyone? ?

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests