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Career in Aviation???? HELP NEEDED!!!

Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 3:59 pm
by Sexy pilot18
This my first time posting on this site! So the Aer Lingus cadet training programme is gone then??!! Why did that happen? So theres no easy way around becoming a pilot for an airline then? Any suggestions? Self funding is a bit pricey at 18 any other routes??........
sexy "pilot"!

Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 6:52 pm
by A330
Sadly 9/11 brought the end to the cadet training

Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 11:23 pm
by TolTol

Loads of info there.

Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 11:59 am
by captwannabe
PPRuNe is a great place to start. There is no easy way to become a pilot, and 99.9% of wannabes have to self-fund. It's expensive, but I like to think of it as an investment (it softens the blow)!

There is one full sponsorship offered by GAPAN per year for a wannabe to train for their fATPL, but the selection process is tough. They also prefer people who have taken steps towards earning a PPL, as this shows they have a firm interest in aviation. I imagine that they would prefer to sponsor UK citizens rather than us across the water because after all they are a British organisation.

There are also cadet sponsorships offered by Atlantic Airlines and Highland Airways, from Coventry ENG and Scotland respectively. These sponsorships require all applicants to have a PPL, often with more than just the minimum hours. Both of these operators use old turboprops in their fleets, and they are normally used for cargo. If you are accepted by either Atlantic or Highland, you will be bonded to them for at least four years. I wouldn't expect to be doing as much flying with them in comparison to other airlines either. Still, they do pay for you training after PPL!

The aviation industry is after redefining the meaning of "sponsorship". From time to time, airlines will offer a "sponsorship" scheme whereby the student will pay for all his or her training, but after graduation, if the airline still has the same recruitment policy, the graduates will be hired. A good example of this at present is Cityjet and Sigmar's IAA integrated course, so I won't go into further detail.

Obviously, self-funding has to be considered. This is where the Bank of Mum and Dad is needed! Modular courses can be done for a (much) lower cost than integrated courses, but whatever route you choose, expect to part with at least ?50k (Have a look at the "never-ending Modular v. Integrated debate" on PPRuNe). If you decide to look at integrated courses, beware of all their marketing bu*lsh*t. OAT (Oxford) are probably the biggest offenders. Glossy brochures with pictures of 737s does not equal a good FTO. Before deciding on any FTO, don't just talk to the propaganda pushers in their marketing department, but also the instructors, and talk to students both past and present, without the instructors around! OAT give employment figures for graduates which are not entirely accurate, as they include people in hold pools (i.e. waiting for a type rating), and considering their huge class sizes, are not impressive. I don't mean to criticise only OAT, but people have to be made aware of their short-comings (they really do have nice brochures!). Wherever you train, politics can/will enter the equation, because if you don't share the views of the management of your FTO, you won't get a recommendation, even if you are the best pilot get the idea?

For me, OAT is out of the question, because of the negative views of the students. It is also the most expensive, with the course costing ?90k+, and accomodation costing ?150 PER WEEK! And that is meant to be ?sterling not ?euro! Not to mention food! Also, they supposedly have recently fired a very good ground school instructor.

Aer Lingus are currently calling back the 2001 cadets, at least the ones who are still in aviation. If they ever start another cadet scheme, I doubt it'll be the same.

Basically, before you decide on where to train, talk to the instructors, and talk to the students. Choose a FTO that suits you. Don't think for a second that the FTO owe you a job, no matter how much money you spend. Sorry for the OAT rant, but in all fairness, even Eddie Hobbs would have trouble comprehending what a complete rip-off it is to train with OAT!


Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 11:43 am
It's easy get a good job and save your ass off til ya have 100,000 to go to the like's of Jerez or Oxford

Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 1:56 pm
by shamrock/heavy
First of all i would like to state that there is nothing EASY about training to be a pilot, whether it be the cadetship route modular route or integrated route its a constant hard battle right up untill you finish line training.I agree 100% with captwannabe's views on FTOs like oxford aviation, if you look on there website they give you figures like 150 graduates employed so far this year etc when in fact these 150 were only given a sim check which most dont get through.Their integrated course is 225 hours, how many guys can handle a 737 on a SID with absolutly no automation at jet speeds with 225 hours.

An airline does not care where you train, once you enter the sim you are judged on personality and your ability to handle the aircraft.what i would do is get CPL MEIR MCC as cheap as possible then get a FIR start instructing and get paid while your building valuable experience and also improving your handling.

Whatever you do dont fall into the trap of going to the place that has the biggest advertising budget and thats what OAT have, why wouldnt they there a PLC floated on the FTSE100 under the name BAE systems.Do your homework before you commit to anything. :wink:

Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2006 8:43 pm
by captwannabe
Ask anyone who has gone through pilot training and they will tell you it was not easy. That includes people who have spent ?100,000! I wouldn't completely agree with doing it the cheapest possible way, because your training should be well structured if going the modular route. Quality not cost should be your primary concern. FTE Jerez seems to me to be the best integrated course, both for value for money and for quality. Just to add to shamrock/heavy's post, of the hypothetical 150 graduates "employed", how many students were on their courses...??? I've just heard of another lemming who has decided to go to OAT because of "graduation statistics". :roll:

I'd like to get peoples' opinions on whether it is better to instruct or to do other GA jobs such as aerial photography/air taxi, if you can't get an airline job after training. I think it would be better to do GA jobs because if you instruct, you'll probably be teaching trial lessons and PPLs when you start, so you won't improve you're flying skills on instruments.

"Do your homework before you commit to anything"
Best advice for anyone.

Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 1:13 pm
by shamrock/heavy
I myself think that instructional hours are great for anyone wishing to go further in aviation.When instructing you have to be aware that the student next to you is inexperienced and will do everything that shouldn't be done in an aircraft eg fly you into cloud while your trying to fix your position on a map, stall the aircraft on the base to final turn,they might pull the mixture when they should have pulled the carb heat, iv even heard of a student that turned the mags off while doing PRACTICE forced landings :oops: .Dealing with all these things on a daily bases makes you more aware, and more capable of dealing with tricky situations.Also if you want to build hours fast there is no better way, you can fly nearly 8 hours a day 7 days a week if you want.

Air taxi work is also very good flying, but you cant build the hours as fast.Remember that you can instruct and do air taxi work aswell as long as you are properly licenced and rated to make the flight theres nothing stopping you and as captwannabe said you can build good instrument hours.

Sexy pilot18 can you start to see now how not easy the whole process is :o

Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 7:30 pm
by captwannabe
s/h, I really appreciate that advice. Very helpful.

Cheers 8)