Requirements of the Terrorism Act 2000

This is a forum for discussing General Aviation in Ireland

Moderator: mark

inverted
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 121
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2004 2:40 pm
Location: Midlands

Post by inverted »

Dear Posters
This thread has turned into a personalised snipe at each other.
It has now become a complete fiasco and should be re-titled " I know more than you...."
Is it that hard to read a post and disagree with it without taking a personalised swipe at the poster?
It is an insult to Mark who has devoted so many hours of his time to get this site to the excellent level it is now at only to see this childish carry on happening!
Have we no manners here…….or am I risking a lecture from someone who can define manners from “rule 26a paragraph 2, line 6 taken from manners in aviation 1962”
Why cant someone who has a point make it, safe in the knowledge that they are not going to get pulverized by a crowd of self-proclaimed experts…it makes me sick.
If one fundamentally disagrees with a point that another member has made then send the alleged offender a private message…. don’t crucify them in public……
To think that the lads on another thread are trying to organise a FII meet in the summer…Jesus lads at this rate it’ll be worse than the Mayday riots if some of us bump into each other ………

Anyway that’s my tuppence worth…

Eagerly awaiting a truly smartarse remark,

Yours etc,
Inverted...
Last edited by inverted on Sun Jan 25, 2009 5:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

j3cub

Post by j3cub »

Post Removed
Last edited by j3cub on Tue Jan 13, 2009 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

stovepipe
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 551
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 9:54 am
Location: Ireland

Post by stovepipe »

Bladecrack,
Just to clarify, you quoted me in your last post as if I was referring to J3Cub. Not so.I know he's up to scratch, as a pilot, from personal experience.My experience of Southern disregard for the letter of the law is based on people I encountered before I ever met J3.
regards
Stovepipe

cross swords
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:22 pm

Post by cross swords »

BlackCrack,
Ever aviator I have met from Northern Ireland have been absolute Gentlemen. In my experience,(UP UNTIL NOW) aviation transcends all.
Your comments are childish. You would seem to have more respect for regulations .....than for the people in your part of Ireland, and the people in our part of Ireland.
Your input ,is nether relevant or welcome.
Thankfully ..things have moved on ...WITHOUT YOU.

I must agree with ifty... IT'S PATHETIC
Last edited by cross swords on Wed Jan 14, 2009 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

Bladecrack
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 81
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 5:41 pm

Post by Bladecrack »

Sorry for the thread hijack, but seeing as J3 started the argument in public I think I have the right of reply, or is free speach not welcome here? (I do also subsribe to FII as it happens)

Stovepipe, despite only being a dumb commercial helicopter (and FW PPL) pilot I did in fact grasp you were not refering specifically to J3.

J3,

1. The procedure for NI (and the UK) changed last year, which is why I helpfully offered the new contact details for Bearcat.
2. If you comply with the rules, why suggest others don't? And why make such a big issue of it in the first place? (you seem to be backtracking somewhat)
3. Just beacuse you have not met the Police doesn't mean they don't exist. I meet them fairly often in the UK and find most of them very easy to deal with if you play ball. However I have been with another pilot on one occasion who was held for 45mins with his pax and threatened with a formal caution for giving incorrect GAR details at a certain UK airport.
4. I think you have shown your true colours by bringing politics into it. Yes, I am based in N.I. now, but guess where I was prior to here? Dublin..
I worked and socialised with a fantastic bunch of guys there, (and at Weston) and met loads of people I am proud to call friends at many Irish airfields. My brother lives in Mayo and I am glad to say the southern hospitality I have seen over the years has been much better than what seems to be evident here?

Despite your attitude I think you would get a warm welcome at any N.I. airfield you chose to visit. Perhaps I will bump into you some day at EGAB as I am a regular there too.

cross swords
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:22 pm

Post by cross swords »

Bladecrack..
Your last post sorted it all.
Fair play to you sir..
Words can be taken up the wrong way.. in typed form.
You are more than welcome in Cowen air space too....
LET THIS BE AN END TO IT!

HAPPY FLYING!

User avatar
viz
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 7:34 pm
Location: Dublin

Post by viz »

Hi

Has anyone got a link to an email friendly Gar form. I can only find PDF format.

Cheers,

jonkil
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:59 am
Location: Donegal. VFR Flight Guide IRL Page 131
Contact:

Post by jonkil »

viz wrote:Hi

Has anyone got a link to an email friendly Gar form. I can only find PDF format.

Cheers,


Hi Viz,
you can download the word doc of the GAR form Click HERE

Regards,
Jon

User avatar
viz
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 7:34 pm
Location: Dublin

Post by viz »

Thanks very much Jon :D

Whisky Tango
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 153
Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2008 9:21 am

Post by Whisky Tango »

Here's the small print from the bottom of that form.....this would seem to settle it I'd say?

Schedule 7 Terrorism Act 2000. Owners/agents of aircraft employed to carry passengers for reward on a journey between Great Britain & Northern Ireland and/or Eire, Isle of Man or Channel Isles (Common Travel Area) shall not arrange for it to call at a port in Great Britain or Northern Ireland to disembark or embark passengers unless the port is a designated port or the examining Police Officer approves the arrangement.
The captain of an aircraft employed on a journey within the Common Travel Area carrying passengers other than for reward shall not permit it to call at or leave a port in Great Britain or Northern Ireland unless it is a designated port or he gives at least 12 hours notice in writing to a constable for the Police area in which the port is situated. (or where the port is in Northern Ireland, to the Police force of Northern Ireland.)

Pilot
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 602
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:39 pm

Post by Pilot »

Spot on WT.

If you want to see the same in the actual leglisation, just go to the TA 200 here
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/ukpga_20000011_en_1
Scroll down to near the end, and click the link for Schedule 7.
Then go to Section 12. It's all very short, and easy to read....the bit you quoted above is from subsection 3 of section 12.

There's nothing new there, but I thought you might like to know where the definative wording comes from ;)

Bluebeard
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 77
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 9:51 am

Post by Bluebeard »

Just a small point re Bladecrack's first post on this thread:
As he says, entry/departure from the UK should be notified to HMRC NCU on the number he gives, with a GAR form.
However this is separate and in addition to the obligation to notify the local police force, using the same GAR form. Notifying Customs does not satisfy the Terrorism Act obligation to notify the relevant police force and the notification periods are different.
There is a third potential recipient of the GAR form, i.e. UK Immigration; however this does not apply to intra-UK or UK/Ireland flights.

Pity a pilot from e.g. France who wants to tour the British Isles, navigating his way thru this cat's cradle of securocracy.

Sorry J3 for the thread creep!

JarJar
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Dec 08, 2008 11:17 pm

Post by JarJar »

Bluebeard,
The pilot from France is luckier than us. He has no requirement for Special Branch.
JJ

Bladecrack
Unverified User
Unverified User
Posts: 81
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 5:41 pm

Post by Bladecrack »

Jar Jar,

I think you will find that the rules here are relitively relaxed in comparison to France..

Over there in order to land (off airfield) at private sites (by helicopter) such as hotels, race courses, and even your own house, the pilot has to apply for a "Heli Surface Permit" from the French authorities up to 6 months prior to use, which is renewable every 3 years. Also written permission must be obtained for each and every landing prior to departure from a) the land owner if a rural area or b) the local mayor if a suburban area, and frequent inspections are made, and fines issued for any pilot not in receipt of the correct paperwork..

Other Eurpopean countries are more stringent than this and forbid "off airfield" landings completely to private owners. And in the likes of Russia for instance, an individual owner of a private helicopter must have it registered with, and managed by a state airline operator, and flight plan approval and permissions sought for every flight from the authorities so that they can keep a close eye on its use, though I'm told this rule may be relaxed in the next few years.

BC

Bluebeard
Verified User
Verified User
Posts: 77
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 9:51 am

Post by Bluebeard »

My reference to a hypothetical pilot from France was merely to highlight the complex notification requirements for flying around within the British Isles. A foreign pilot would surely have difficulty figuring out what to send to which authority and when. He would be really perplexed as to why the police should be notified of intra-UK flights, between NI and GB. Flights to the "offshore islands" of IoM and the Channel Islands have another layer of requirements. It's hard enough for those of us English-speakers who have studied the requirements, to make all the notifications to the right parties (and it can be really quite difficult sometimes to identify the right police contact point for a particular UK airfield). Other than for UK customs, there is no central notification point, and different UK police forces have different ideas as to how the Terrorism Act notification requirements are to be satisfied (including in some cases the false idea that their permission is required).

Contrast this with the simplicity with which private pilots can make domestic and international flights from airfields within the Schengen countries - just a flight plan.

Post Reply